I came across a stamp combination that has me flummoxed. Take a look.
How did a Gaillard stamp find its way onto a pot made in Villedieu?
In my experience, that “Villedieu France” stamp usually indicates this pan was made in Normandy (most likely by Mauviel), but Gaillard was a Paris-based operation. As late as 1956, they had their own manufacturing facility in the 20ième.
But I believe this is a late-era Gaillard mark towards the end of the firm’s existence in the 1980s. Did there come a time when Gaillard stopped manufacturing its own copper and outsourced to Villedieu? I find it hard to believe that Gaillard would sell another’s work under its own name, or vice-versa. Could an old Gaillard pan have been picked up and re-stamped for sale in Villedieu, even if it had not been made there? Or was Gaillard in such dire straits that it bought Villedieu pans wholesale and re-stamped them?
If you have any information to explain this, I’d be very interested. Have you seen any other combinations of Gaillard and Villedieu stamps?
Outsourcing by Gaillard to Mauviel seems to be the most logical answer in my opinion.
The Villedieu mark is one of the modern ones so I suspect this is a second half of the 20th century Villedieu made Mauviel stamped Gaillard retailed by them but not made by them – as we all know lots of retailers did this. Is it a sign of the demise of Gaillard just before they went out of business?? Very interesting though. As usual, great question VFC!!
Makes me wonder if, towards the end, Gaillard was experimenting with being a reseller, leveraging its name and customer relationships rather than making its own pieces. I have difficulty telling 1970s-1980s Gaillard from Mauviel — could it be they were actually one and the same? I know Mauviel was perfectly happy to stamp its copper for others, but to my knowledge those other entities were retail stores or established restaurant supply stores. Gaillard during its lifetime, it was effectively a competitor to Mauviel — it never had a retail presence to my knowledge nor did it supply goods other than copper. But am I overestimating the level of competitiveness in this industry? Would Mauviel and Gaillard not have cared if customers couldn’t tell their goods apart?
Hello VFC, I have found a picture of Gaillard with the Made in France stamp, it’s a 20cm saute I sold back in 2015. I will send via email. Another piece of the puzzle?
Thanks Fid! Have you checked out my post on the Made in France stamp? I’ve been trying to connect specific styles of that stamp to the different makers. So far I’ve seen 1960s-1980s Gaillard with the “two-line, rectangular shape, long M” style, and I’m keeping an eye out for that same stamp alongside other makers’ marks to see if there’s overlap. What do you think?
Yes I think that is a good idea VFC. Chomette Favor, A Simon and maybe Michel Lejeune would be good ones to look at? I am sending you copies of what I have via email. Lets see!
There is a vendor in France who is selling fake Gaillard on Ebay by stamping Gaillard on other maker’s products. I have a re-tinning shop and noticed the unusual Gaillard stamps recently.
Hello David could you email me too with the listings, I would be very interested to find out. This can hurt the whole industry. email@example.com
Hi David — That’s a pretty serious allegation. Without naming names, can you give more information about what you think is happening? You can also email me if you’d like — vfc at vintagefrenchcopper dot com.
I just emailed you with the listings.
Folks, take a look: https://francelorrainecollection.fr/FAKE-GAILLARD-STAMP/
This vendor is in the UK.
I have also noted the “Gaillard” pans listed by this seller and they seemed highly suspect. We had actually discussed one of these pans in November 2019 in your posting about a particular handle you were finding on some copper pans. The pan in question had early dovetailed construction yet was marked with a relatively modern Gaillard stamp with indications of a rectangular border. I did not know that the very knowledgeable TJ France had already written an article on these probably bogus stamped pans. It’s a shame that this type of deception in “collectibles” has seemingly now found a home in vintage copper pans.
Has anyone reached out to the seller to ask about this? If so, what was the response?
Good morning all !
No panic !!!!
Please don’t start to see fake stamps everywhere.
This stamping is completely normal and it is not a mystery, I would even say that it is logical.
Sorry for not having enough time to complete all of my records. But this question is already part of a subject that I started a long time ago but which is not yet finished (as I have a lot!).
So do not worry, even if this pot was sold by a fraudster, this stamping is not a fake.
See you soon and take good care of yourself and your family in this difficult coronavirus period.
Hi TJ! Thank you! This post ended up with some comments that went in a different direction. The original post is about a genuine Gaillard stamp with a genuine Villedieu stamp; David came in to comment about a separate issue — a questionable (and misleading) Gaillard stamp that has been discussed in great detail here: https://www.vintagefrenchcopper.com/2020/03/the-misleading-gaillard-paris-stamp/
If you can shed any light on the original question of this post — how a pan could end up with stamps from Paris-based Gaillard as well as Villedieu — I’d love to hear more. But at the moment I agree with you that both stamps on THIS pan are — thankfully! — legitimate.
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